E Dog
November 4th, 2009Last night I was out for food and drink with an American friend of mine and Princess tagged along. Leo could not make it, as he was on the roof of a building someplace in BKK filming a movie from dusk to dawn.
At one point Princess and I were talking about his social life and I called him an E dog. My American friend was not familiar with this Thai phrase, so I explained that E dog means slut, but is only used by gays. The more common word for slut is “rat”, but sounds like “lat”, and is only in reference to the conduct of a woman. Gays will also use rat interchangeable with E dog. Thus, when a gay uses either word it can be about the conduct of a man or woman, but straights would not use E dog and would never call any male a rat.
Let me stop here for a second and remind you of an earlier post I made about teaching some of the boys the American gay phrase “Miss Thing”.
If you recall I said teaching them this was useful for setting a tone. Thus, if I wanted to express my dislike for something, but not come across as seriously scolding, prefacing it with “Miss Thing” set a softer tone. This is important, because Thais just learning English can not always pick up on the subtle differences in tone we use. Thai language uses words to set tone, so this was my way of doing the same in English. You may also recall that I was surprised how quickly the boys caught on to what “Miss Thing” meant, but after last night I understand why.
Now I know most of you from other countries are not familiar with the “Miss Thing” phrase, so let’s please not rehash that one again…OK?
With that explained, I can continue with the story.
Next I told my friend there are a lot of words in Thai that begin with E, but I wasn’t sure why. Princess chimed in and said E means woman, and he used the example of E nee (E knee) which I was already familiar with, but did not completely understand how or why it was used. My general understanding has been that it is used in the beginning of a statement to communicate you are correcting someone’s behavior. As an example, if he forgets to take out the trash you might begin by saying E nee, followed with a reminder the trash needs to be taken out. I think of it as setting a tone that is somewhat parental in nature, but not overly harsh.
Princess continued by reminding me the Thai word “nee” means “this”, so adding E to it is like saying “woman this”. At that point I got excited and said, “So it same I say Miss Thing?” Princess said, “YES!”  Now I understand why they were able to pick up on the phrase so quickly.
This morning I asked Princess if all “E” words are gay, and he said no, just some are. Then I double checked with him that E dog is only used by gays. He told me that women are now starting to use it, as well. He said, in Thailand, women are beginning to adopt the unique vocabulary of gays. I took that to mean the women that hang out with gays, and said the same is true in America. Then I confirmed with him that while women are starting to use gay words and phrases, straight men do not.
Another one I know of that’s gay is to put E in front of a person’s name. So if you are talking to or about Joe, adding E is a way of being campy…E Joe, or Woman Joe.
It’s funny how, over time, things like this come together in bits and pieces. I’ll learn about something and six months later get another piece of the puzzle that brings me closer to the big picture.
November 4th, 2009 at 8:18 pm
there’s also the expression in america, “horn dog”, often used for a horny straight guy.
November 5th, 2009 at 10:59 am
I asked my bf about “e nee”. His response was “not polite”.
November 5th, 2009 at 12:22 pm
I know a Thai lady whose husband is from Edam (in the Netherlands).
Rather unfortunate when other Thais ask where he is from - E dam is very rude in Thai!
November 5th, 2009 at 2:58 pm
Margaret Mead and Ovid,
Your comments sparked my curiosity, so I went back to Princess and learned the following…
ALL E words in Thai are considered in poor taste and only acceptable if used among friends in a joking context.
Edam means you are telling someone he has black (dam) skin. Black is how Thais describe dark toned skin, and something most Thais try to avoid. If I understood correctly, adding E to the front of it makes the statement derogatory in nature. Even more so than simply stating a fact that everyone can observe.
November 6th, 2009 at 2:55 pm
No No No
this is not quite right. And it’s bad advice. Ai and EE should be used with caution. And Dok means flower. And saying certain words to a certain person that starts with these can actually get you arrested by the police. No joke. I think you should check with princess again.
November 6th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
E is a highly offensive word for women matching aii for men.
it was used in the past like khun is today but only for lower classes & slaves therefor it denotes low social status/class
you can say e before a womens name eg e Noy (low class) woman instead of khun Noy (mid upper class women)It is always insulting when used with strangers even sometimes with friends
you can use it in front of adjectives & insults to make them stronger like Khun Baa(you crazy)into e Baa (crazy bitch)
E DOK/DOG is a shortening of E DOK TONG which refers the golden flower(dok tong) which has a strong scent that attracts flys/bees and compares a women with a lot of men with a flower with a lot of flies
its charming and insulting at the same time very Thai.
Amongst all my Thai gay and many female friends e is everyday usage you can sometimes even catch e nee used on the 8.30pm ++ TV soap operas
but as always the rules are different for farangs and some of my farang friends have found themselves in hot water with the locals for uncontrolled us of the E me included!!
November 6th, 2009 at 11:28 pm
Thanks anotheranon,
I appreciate the clarification. It has also been my experience that E words are commonly used by the gays I hang around, which are a mix of middle and lower class, all in their 20’s.
I’ve made it a point to avoid learning the “bad” words in Thai, because its very difficult to know when it is acceptable to use them. The same is true with the boys learning English. I know one that learned the word shit and thought it was acceptable to start most sentences with it. It took several attempts to convince him this was a bad idea.
November 7th, 2009 at 4:46 am
I was always told Edok = Bitch. My boyf would always ask me to call his girlfriend this and they all thought it was funny.
November 10th, 2009 at 9:04 pm
Interesting post and replies. There are a number of words and phrases that are,much in the same way as they are in english, fun/joking and yet highly offensive at the same time…..and i have to say it is sometimes down to the slightest of nuances the difference between using it in the right or wrong context.
English example in Restaurant…your steak is ‘off’ the menu sir….you answer the waiter with “really?” “oh darn it” (acceptable)
“no shit?” “fuck that” (unacceptable)
But it is perfectly acceptable to use the second example of the phrase with friends.
It is the same with Thais…..but further compounded when a farang tries to use certain phrases even with close friends.I am absolutely banned from uttering certain “bad” words or phrases even when i am just together with my bf.
Hoo-kee (Issan-Lao for ‘asshole’ or more precisely ’shithole’) is one he really hates(not say that!) and attracts a punch even if i am using it very jokingly together even if about someone else.
The english phrase “fuck you” or showing the middle digit….with people you know is mildly offensive but jokey…yet according to my bf he and his friends understand this phrase or use of the middle digit as highly offensive in any context or situation and to them it means “fuck your mother” which in the wrong circumstances especially where drink has been consumed could result in threats even with gays.
My Issan bf regularly uses a term within a sentence to friends and even family members which is “ha-meung” which basically means “fuck off” example…if u asked someone the time and they said 8pm when it was actually 8.30pm you would say “8pm?..(ha-meung)fuck-off its 8.30!”….but he has warned me quite sternly that it is NOT a phrase which a farang should try to get away with in any situation.
EEdok (anotheranon is correct with the eedok-tong info)i notice is hardly used outside Bangkok in my experience…i never really hear it in Issan..and hear it very very rarely in Pattaya except by the katoey comedians in the risque joking at clubs like NAB or Xray and the like….but when i used to mix with Bkk gay guys it was used very much indeed especially after a few drinks between gay friends. It was explained to me as “slut/slutty” or even “prostitute”….. I have found the more common word in Issan and Pattaya for “slut” or “slutty” is Galee/Garee especially if you are very promiscious…this is one of the words i am ok to use in thai company when joking around.
The farang owner/manager of a guesthouse/hotel my bf and i were staying in was joking with a couple of Thai staff members..and he used the term EEba…”crazy” but the insertion of EE in this case in public was VERY low class according to my Issan bf….”not good! why he talk like that when everybody can hear?” whispered to me…..
So yes according to my experiences Thais regard EE infront of certain words/phrases as very offensive in the wrong context. But just to show an example of nuances….when i want to say “what?” in Thai i dont use “arai?” or “arai-na?” i tend to use “yang?”(Issan)but more commonly “EEyang?” and my bf says this is a perfectly ok substitution for “arai” even with EE at the front…..so it is very confusing…
Probably one of the best pieces of advice i see here in this thread by the webmaster is to not learn too many of the swear/bad Thai words because mis-usage can lead to GREAT embarassment for not only you but your bf or host and even in the more extreme situation can cause problems.
Sorry about the length of this reply, but i would be keen to know if anyone has experienced the same or different from mine.
November 13th, 2009 at 3:28 am
Alaan,
No problem with the long comment. Your contribution was most informative. It is the comments like yours, and those from others that really give this web site value. I post something and others add, refine, or disagree. The end result is everyone gets a clearer picture, and that is what’s most important.